Some enlarged and 'tweaked' known photos of Me 262s

[Karoband]

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1011

174. Like W.Nr. 111685 9K+FH, white "9" was dragged south along the autobahn and is seen among the other aircraft assembled for scrapping at the Brunnthal collection yard. Note the similar damage to the base of the tail fin. The rear fuel tank lying beneath it is likely from white surround "34" whose port wing is seen lower right.


http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1010

175. This picture shows the nose of white "9" at Brunnthal. Photos of both sides of the fuselage shoe that the "white 9" was painted over a previous dark numeral. Also, like 111685, this aircraft has no white gun rectangles.


http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1009

176. O'Connell on page 128 states that 111617 was fitted with an experimental wooden tail. However, when it was discovered by the Ameicans, it had standard camouflage on its tail with the werknummer under the hakenkreuz, but a white rudder with a standard late-production tail light bulb had replaced the kaulquappe rudder.

[Karoband]

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1012

177. In April 1945, III./EJG 2 had a reconnaissance "Conversion Detachment" at Lechfeld (see Nick Beale's latest updates on "Ghostbombers": "1./NAG 1 and the Me 262: disbandment of 1./NAGr 13 before completing its conversion"). In a table on Me 262 dispositions dated 10 April 1945, found in RL 2/III 624, eleven jets from "NAGr 1 u 6" had already been handed over to III/EJG 2. These were likely A-4s (aka A-1a/U3s) and at least one Me 262 B-1a trainer. At Lechfeld, III./EJG 2 possibly gave these the white-surround identities "25" to "35", painted in front of their cockpits.
This photo shows how white-surround "34" was found by American forces in the Hofoldinger Forest in May 1945. At first glance, it seems that only the reconnaissance nose assembly has simply been exchanged for a dark-camouflaged standard fighter nose with four MK 108 cannon.

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1013

178. In thread #44720/post #17 of this forum, David E. Brown identifies this Me 262 as W.Nr. 500252. This mediocre photo shows that only the starboard engine nacelle had suffered a detonation. Note the intact cannibalized Jumo 004 on the port side with a bare metal forward cowling. This lends credence to the idea that the A-4s found at Lechfeld had been given over to III./EJG2.

[Karoband]

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1014

179. In this photo, mechanics are in the process of removing the port turbine from white-surround "34". It is missing in some photos. Note the damage at the base of the tail fin indicates that it had been dragged backwards along Autobahn A8 by a thin cable to this spot in the Brunnthal collection yard.

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1015

180. This photo shows that only the body of the fuselage and tail remained of the original aircraft. Undoubtedly at the workshops in Lechfeld, it not only got a new nose assembly, but a wing so new it was not painted nor given national markings. Note the leather-covered fuel tanks lying on the ground. On page 109 of Brown etal., Messerschmitt Me 262 Production & Arado Ar 234 Final Operations, (Japo, 2012) is a view of the port side of "34" showing where scavengers have peeled away the side of thefuselage to remove its rear fuel tank. On the same page we are told that the engines found on "34" were from two different aircraft.

[Dan O'Connell]

"176. O'Connell on page 128 states that 111617 was fitted with an experimental wooden tail. However, when it was discovered by the Ameicans, it had standard camouflage on its tail with the werknummer under the hakenkreuz, but a white rudder with a standard late-production tail light bulb had replaced the kaulquappe rudder.[/quote]"

I have no idea why 111617's original wooden rudder was replaced, as it had been found to be in good shape on April 1, but as shown at the dump, it was NOT the original rudder. I am unaware of any photos of 617 with it's original rudder.

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1013

178. In thread #44720/post #17 of this forum, David E. Brown identifies this Me 262 as W.Nr. 500252. This mediocre photo shows that only the starboard engine nacelle had suffered a detonation. Note the intact cannibalized Jumo 004 on the port side with a bare metal forward cowling. This lends credence to the idea that the A-4s found at Lechfeld had been given over to III./EJG2.[/quote]

My understanding is that this is actually 500004.

[quote=Karoband;320583]http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1012

177. In April 1945, III./EJG 2 had a reconnaissance "Conversion Detachment" at Lechfeld (see Nick Beale's latest updates on "Ghostbombers": "1./NAG 1 and the Me 262: disbandment of 1./NAGr 13 before completing its conversion"). In a table on Me 262 dispositions dated 10 April 1945, found in RL 2/III 624, eleven jets from "NAGr 1 u 6" had already been handed over to III/EJG 2. These were likely A-4s (aka A-1a/U3s) and at least one Me 262 B-1a trainer. At Lechfeld, III./EJG 2 possibly gave these the white-surround identities "25" to "35", painted in front of their cockpits.
This photo shows how white-surround "34" was found by American forces in the Hofoldinger Forest in May 1945. At first glance, it seems that only the reconnaissance nose assembly has simply been exchanged for a dark-camouflaged standard fighter nose with four MK 108 cannon.

The A4's were converted at Eger, where after conversion, they were given their unique paint camo and numbers. After they were transfered to III./EJG 2 at Lechfeld, they RETAINED their original fuselage numbers.

[Karoband]

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1016

181. On 10 June 1945, Watson's Whizzers flew nine refurbished Me 262s out of Lechfeld on their way to Cherbourg, France, for shipment to the USA. Left behind were at least fifteen other Me 262s, some cannibalized for parts, that were parked in front of an intact hangar used by the Americans. Their usefulness over, these Me 262s were then towed behind the hangar to be left derelict over the winter of 1945-1946 before being scrapped. This mediocre picture shows that among them was Me 262 A-1a W.Nr. 110956 white "17+S" of III./EJG 2. To its far left, the dark Me 262 is undoubtedly W.Nr. 113363 seen with the same wooden platform at a different angle on page 154 of Dan O'Connell's Production Log.


http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1017

182. On page 145 of Jurleit's Strahljäger Me 262 Das Technikgeschichte, (1992), he identifies a "Tippel" as one of the "Überführungspiloten ferrying Me 262s from REIHAHG/Kahla to Zerbst. In post #64 of this thread, David E. Brown has Günther Tipple as transferring W.Nr. 110955 from Kahla to Zerbst on 13 March 1945. In thread #25583/post #4, Dan O'Connell writes, "In that Flugbuch, by Guenther Tippel are three "new" W.Nr., 110951, 110955 and 110960 ...". Since W.Nr 110956 falls in that range of werknummern, it too may be from REIMAHG/Kahla which may explain its distinctive markings.

[Karoband]

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1018

183. This photo shows some unusual markings for a 110xxx Series aircraft administered by the Augsburg consortium. As seen with W.Nr. 111685 in the Hofoldinger Forest, instead of a black hakenkreuz with a white surround, this one has the simple black version of the 500xxx Series of the Regensburg administration with the entire werknummer ahead of the lowest point of the hakenkreuz. However, in this case, the werknummer is also found on both sides of the tail fin, not just the port side. Most noteworthy, moreover, is the simple black balkenkreuz on the sides of the rear fuselage and the undersides of the wings of a fully-camouflaged Me 262. This is distinctive also to to Me 262 A-1a 110950 white "10+S" found at an unknown waldwerk and yellow "3+S" of 9./KG(J) 6 found at Saaz/Zatec [see pp. 152-153 of Brown, etal., Messerschmitt Me 262s of KG & KG(J) units, (JaPo, 2021)]. Yellow "3+S" is the only Me 262 with an "S" warning not to exceed 800 Km/h I have seen with a tactical fighter numeral on the rear fuselage.

There is another fully-camouflaged Me 262 with black balkenkreuze but without the "S" designation discussed in thread #43198 as perhaps coded TS+MB. This would make it a discarded Me 262 being used as a static trainer at the Technical School at Schleissheim. If my speculation as to this werknummer series is correct, then the quality of these Me 262s produced at REIMAHG/Kahla may have been inferior.

The W.Nr. 110956, seen here, already has a replaced nose assembly.

[Dan O'Connell]

Jim, can you CONFIRM 110950 as an actual aircraft? I have no information as to that WN.

[Karoband]

Hi Dan,

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/album....pictureid=1019

First, I need to apologize to David E. Brown and his colleagues for my mistake in quoting the place where white "10+S" was found. The exact quote from their book is "... and W.Nr. 110950 "White 10" found at an unknown Waldwerk." I will correct my error above.

The attached photo I found on the internet is slightly larger than that in David's book but has had the hakenkreuz and I suspect part of the werknummer censored. These are not censored in David's book. Thus I can only confirm the existence of white "10+S". Since David and his colleagues have access to the original photo and have published the werknummer as 110950, I presume they have seen it.

best regards,

Jim

[Dan O'Connell]

It "looks" like the same place 755 was found. Some say near Lechfeld.

[Dan O'Connell]

Thanks for the photo Jim!