Transfere loose ends

[Johannes]

Hi Guys

I am tying up some loose ends on pilots who possibly share the same name, and would be grateful for any help:-

Oberleutnant Ernst Bar

who made twelve claims with 7./Jg77(eleven confirmed) from 29th august 1941 until 15th September 1941 before being wounded on 20th September 1941. Here nothing more about him, but have found a Hauptmann Ernst Bar killed on 18th August 1943 with the Staff of Jg11, surely the same guy, but cannot be sure.

Leutnant Hans-joachim Harder

who made two claims with 2./Jg26 on 3rd July 1941 and 11th July 1941. Again hear nothing more about him, but there is a Oberleutnant Hans-joachim Harder killed on 29th November 1943 with 6./Jg1, again this could be the same guy.

Feldwebel Wilhelm Knoller

who was wounded on 11th November 1943 and killed on 19th April 1944 with 1./Jg1. I suspect that he is the Unteroffizier Knoller of 1./Jg50 who made a claim on 14th october 1943. Jg50 pilots did seem to end up with Jg1/Jg11.

Leutnant Karl-Friedrich Krocher

who made a claim on 5th October 1943 with 3./Jg105. Formerly of the Staff of II./Jg52. I suspect he could be the Leutnant Friedrich-Karl Krocher killed on 11th April 1944 with 8./Jg11.

Leutnant Kneip

who made four claims with 9./Jg3 between 12th September 1942 and 16th December 1942, then we hear of nothing more, but I have a Leutnant Rudolf Kneip making claims on 4th March 1944 and 8th March 1944 and killed on 15th March 1944 with 3./Jg300, could these guys be one and the same I wonder?

Oberfahnrich Gunter Michel

who was killed with 13./Jg300 on 21st December 1944. I have an Oberfahnrich Michel making a claim on 29th September 1944 with 1./Jg76. Good chance these are one and the same!

Leutnant Heinrich Otteking

who made three claims with III./Jg26 and 8./JG26 between 31st May 1940 and 11th September 1940, but again we hear nothing more about him, yet there is an Oberleutnant Heinrich Otteking killed with 1./Jg302 on 20th august 1944, again likely to be the same guy.

Unteroffizier Heinz Sachse

who was killed on 1st January 1945 with 16./Jg300. I have a Gefreiter Sachse making a claim on 27th September 1944 with 4./Jg76, again could be the same guy.

Feldwebel Heinrich Vielhaber

who made a claim with 1./Jg26 on 28th May 1940, again hear nothing else about him, but there was a Hauptmann Heinrich Vielhaber killed with 10./Jg300, could this be the same guy rapidly promoted I wonder?

Grateful for any more informamtion on these guys like date of birth, other units, anything really.

Kind Regards

Johannes

[Matti Salonen]

Hans-Joachim Harder, who was killed on 29th November 1943 had EKM number from I/JG 26.

According to NVM it was Lt Adolf Kneip, who was killed on 15th March 1944.

Heinrich Oetteking, who was killed on 20th August 1944 had EKM number from 7./JG 26.

Heinrich Vielhaber, who was killed on 14th March 1945 had EKM number from 1./JG 26.

Matti

[Johannes]

Hi Matti

Thanks for that, So Harder, Vielhaber and Otteking did switch units.

I have a few more for you to dwell on:-

Gefreiter Paul Messmer

He made four claims over Russian aircraft as a flieger and Gefreiter with 3./Jg51 between 14th January 1944 and 16th September 1945, and was killed on 16th January 1945. I have a flieger Paul Messmer wounded on 7th February 1942 with IV./Jg1, the extreme low rank in each case makes me think they are the same guy.

Feldwebel Franz Michalke

He made a claim on 6th November 1941 with 2./Jg54, then he was wounded on 22nd February 1942, and nothing more heard about him. However I have a Feldwebel Franz Michalke injured with 9./Jg11 on 29th August 1943, rank and name match.

Leutnant Prenzler

He made two claims with 10./Jg5 on 14th October 1943 and 8th May 1944. But i found a Leutnant Kurt Prenzler killed with 3./Jg11 on 12th June 1944, could be the same guy!

Unteroffizier Ludwig Rossner

He made ten claims in Russia with 5./Jg77 between 20th March 1942 and 15th September 1942, I don't have losses for Jg77 for 1943, and i can find no further trance of him, until I found an Unteroffizier Ludwig Rossner killed on 29th September 1944 with 11./Jg11, I suspect he was wounded in 1943 and that he then moved to this unit.

Unteroffizier Fritz Schneider

He made five claims over Russian aircraft between 13th July 1943 and 19th September 1943 with IV./Jg51, but after this I can find no later references with him with Jg51. But, now I have found an Unteroffizier Fritz Schneider killed with 6./Jg1 on 16th May 1944.....but such a common name.

Leutnant Widmann

He made a claim with 3./Jg54 on 13th July 1943, afterwhich I hear no more about him. But, I found an Unteroffizier Michael Widmann going missing with 2./Jg11 on 9th october 1943, could be the same guy?

Kind Regards

Johannes

[Matti Salonen]

Meßmer, who was killed on 16th Jan 1945 has got an EKM number from Erg.Gr./JG 51. Why had he been Flieger for two years before promotion to Gefreiter? He was born in 1920, which makes your assumption possible.

I can confirm that Michalkes are one and a same guy (same EKM on both NVMs).

I don't have Lt Kurt Prenzler in my databse on 12th June 1944. Could you please tell details of this loss?

Both Rößner and Schneider, when shot down, had got EKM number from Erg.JGr. Rößner was born in mid 1922 and Schneider was born in late 1923.

Lt Franz Widman from 3./JG 54 was taken POW on 25th Aug 1943.
Lt Michael Widman from 2./JG 11 was MIA on 9th Oct 1943. So not the same guy.

Matti