Erich Hartmann - several questions

[Nikita Egorov]

Diego,

My experience with Russian accounts is the opposite: I mistrust when a Soviet pilot says "I shot this aircraft down" and do not give more details. I gave more reliability if the pilot gives a lot of details. Of course I know that, if there is not corresponding loss from the other side, even if the account is vivid, it is likely an overclaim.
Certainly is quite probable that Hahn's victor was Grazhdanikov and not Begeldinov. Wait please till I translate both accounts, and we can discuss about this. Of course, it is quite probable, that you are right

You do not have to translate this piece of narration, at least for me, because I have written it myself.
No matter whether report is full of details or have none of them, only matching other side records could give any result in real confirmation of a claim. Lots of details in report could have their origins in pilot's imagination.

By whom was shot down then? I used Prien as source, who listed Stracnizky downed in "Luftkampf" on 24 August 1942, and Danilov's claim matched quite closely in place and time. There were other Soviet claiminants that day, like for example 296 IAP's Yak-1 pilots Boris Yeromin and Aleksandr Solomatin, but they tangled with Bf.109Gs of I./JG 53.
Furthermore, I distrust the German loss archives. As Dánes Bárnad stated here, the Germans were much less reliable than the Russians to record losses, and that matches my experience with them. Furthermore, the racial prejudices caused that the Germans always prefered credit losses to AAA or "accidents" than to the Soviet "untermeschen" pilots. It varied on unit and period of time, but there is always a huge underestimation of losses causes by Soviet flighters.

Could I ask you a question: where did you find exact time of Stracnizky's crash and Danilov's claim? Another question is how did you get to conclusion that Yeryomin and Solomatin clashed with I/JG53, instead of JG3. And the last question could you please list other Soviet fighters claims against Bf-109s in this area this day (I could give you a hint, in general there were nine of them)
As regards to loss records, I believe you have got Denes in a wrong way, how you can compare this if you do not see original records from one side and you know that the majority of orginal files from another side has been lost?

[DiegoZampini]

Nikita:
Once again, I apologyze for replying to your posts that later. The scholar year began shortly before here in Argentina, and I have my hands full with my work as teacher. Furthermore, I am organizing the visit of my Russian girlfriend to my country (she will meet my family) and I want that everything will be allright. But tonight and tomorrow I'll have some free time and answer your replies:

Originally Posted by Nikita Egorov

Diego,
You do not have to translate this piece of narration, at least for me, because I have written it myself.

Ponyal (Understood). No ya sdelal dlya vsex chitatelyax, kotoryx ne mogut ponimat' russkiy yazyk (But I did for all readers, that cannot understand Russian )

No matter whether report is full of details or have none of them, only matching other side records could give any result in real confirmation of a claim. Lots of details in report could have their origins in pilot's imagination.

But how can you fully match on the other side's records are that uncomplete as German ones? I fully agree with you that to research the opponent's loss records give the real confirmation (or ultimate discarding) of a certain claim, and I also know that veterans' memories can fool even themselves (assuming good faith).
But when one finds that many gaps as one can find in Luftwaffe loss records, that a loss is not mentioned there it does not mean it did not occur. Furthermore, even knowing that veterans' memoirs can be very unaccurate (and knowing that is always better to back them up with official documents), Why to discard veterans' testimonies that quickly? After all, THEY WERE THERE, not you, neither I nor most of researchers.

Could I ask you a question: where did you find exact time of Stracnizky's crash and Danilov's claim? Another question is how did you get to conclusion that Yeryomin and Solomatin clashed with I/JG53, instead of JG3. And the last question could you please list other Soviet fighters claims against Bf-109s in this area this day (I could give you a hint, in general there were nine of them)

Regarding Stracnizky-Danilov: I admitt that time I did not find, but Prien place Stracnizky in Pl.Q. 49161, which is (if I did not misplaced it) over Stalingrad outskirts, N of the city. Bergstrom indicates that most of 265 Soviet sorties that day (specially Shturmoviks) were N-NW of the city to cut supplies to General Hube's 16th Pazerdivision. The place matched.
Regarding Yeryomin and Solomatin: they scored victories in the same combat, and it was logical to assume that they scored them against aircraft of the same unit. There were no two losses in JG 3, but there were two in I./JG 53:
-Bf.109G-2 W.Nr. 14161 Uffz. Gustav Perl (MIA, Experte with 12 victories)
-Bf.109G-2 W.Nr. 13552 Uffz. Heinz Seig (WIA, Experte with 15 victories) (Engine failure?)
Other Soviet claims that day that I know (all over the city itself):
-Ivan P. Motornyy Yak-1 512 IAP, 220 IAD Ju.88 (probably Ju.88D-1 W.Nr.1680 4 KIAs 3.(F)/121)
-Grigoriy K. Gultyayev Yak-1 788 IAP, 102 IAD PVO Ju.87 (probably Ju.87D W.Nr.2432 Crew Unknown 75% written off 1./StG 77) (Accident?)
-Ivan M. Dzyuba Yak-1 12 IAP, 288 IAD Bf.109 (probably Bf.109E-7 W.Nr.6392 Fw. Hans Beruwka MIA 3./SchG 1) (Cause unknown)
That makes 6 identified claims. Evidently there are 3 additional claims that I ignore. Please, if I wrongly cross-referenced German losses with Soviet claiminants, correct my mistakes, and if you want share with us your findings. I am willing to learn from my mistakes and correct them.

As regards to loss records, I believe you have got Denes in a wrong way, how you can compare this if you do not see original records from one side and you know that the majority of orginal files from another side has been lost?

PROBABLY YOU ARE RIGHT ON THAT, NIKITA.
BTW, Yevgeny Velichko told me that you are working on a book about the Air Battle of Stalingrad. Congratulations!! It is already in the Russian book stores? I want to buy it!
Kind regards,
Diego

PS: I will repeat this post in a new thread "Soviet air victories over Stalingrad" in the "Soviet and Allied air forces" forum, to do not desvirtuate the original topic (Hartmann's). If you consider that this is the right thing to do, reply there.