Luftflotte 4 losses Apr.-Jun.1943: a comparison of the different data

[Andrey Kuznetsov]

Hello Andreas,

Thank you for the answer

Regards,
Andrey

[Andrey Kuznetsov]

New example of remarkable discrepancy between different German sources:

It is a fragment of German report about Soviet aviation activity 23.Jun.42:
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/attach...1&d=1432415534

Among victims of the bombing of Bryansk airfield are listed the following FW189:

1 - 90%, 1 - 70%, 4 - 50%, 1 - 30%. In all 7 FW189 with damages 30% or higher.

GQM returns:
23 June during the bombing of Bryansk airfield:
w/n 0197 from 2.(H)/13 - 70%
w/n 2193 from 2.(H)/13 - 60%
w/n 2192 from 2.(H)/13 - 30%
All in all 3 instead of 7 losses.

Also, for comparison with “Flugzeugbestand und Bewegungsmeldungen”:
26 June w/n 2187 from 2.(H)/13 - 25% without enemy action.
So in GQM returns for June 4 FW189 with damages 25-70%

July GQM returns for 2.(H)/13:
9 July w/n 2111 - 25% due to enemy action
18 July w/n 0072 - 25% without enemy action
19 July w/n 0154 - 20% due to enemy action
All in all 3 FW189 with damages 20-25%

“Flugzeugbestand und Bewegungsmeldungen” for 2.(H)/13:
June 1942: 2 losses due to enemy action
July 1942: 3 to Überholung (overhaul)

It looks like two most damaged FW189 were written off and maybe 3 other were sent to Überholung in the next month, and the rest were repaired within the unit

Anyway for June losses of 2.(H)/13, from minimum 8 FW189 with damages 25-90% only half (4) are listed in GQM returns. 50% are missed.

[Andreas Brekken]

Originally Posted by Andrey Kuznetsov

Anyway for June losses of 2.(H)/13, from minimum 8 FW189 with damages 25-90% only half (4) are listed in GQM returns. 50% are missed.

Or the information, most likely with regards to damage extent, was corrected in a later correspondance that we do not have.

We have a hint with regards to the Einsatzbereitschaft of the unit, were it was reported as 9 FW 189, 7 serviceable on June 20th 1942 - and 8 FW 189 on June 30th, but only 4 serviceable.

The possibility that the unit received a large number of replacement aircraft of this type in such a short timespan is rather slim, looking at the Zuweisungen for June 1942, there is definitely no large number of FW 189 for the Luftwaffenkommand Ost which commanded the unit at the time - in reality it seems they have not requested any between June 16th an June 30th - possibly due to having 8 airframes available - even if the number of serviceable was only 4 on the 30th.

On July 10th the unit report 6 aircraft, 4 serviceable, most likely 2 of the 3 mentioned as sent to overhaul in July are the 2 deducted in the strength return.

A very nice find Andrey, hopefully it is possible to find something else to make this even clearer.

Regards,
Andreas B

[Andrey Kuznetsov]

Hello Andreas,

thank you, valuable as always.

Originally Posted by Andreas Brekken

We have a hint with regards to the Einsatzbereitschaft of the unit, were it was reported as 9 FW 189, 7 serviceable on June 20th 1942 - and 8 FW 189 on June 30th, but only 4 serviceable.

Do you have the data for June 10th and July 20th? It may make clear the timeframe of delivery and “Abgang”.
And, June 20th, for example - is it the evening data or morning?

Originally Posted by Andreas Brekken

Or the information, most likely with regards to damage extent, was corrected in a later correspondance that we do not have.

I’ll try to find the June-July reports, maybe they contains a correction really.

Or maybe among 7 damaged FW189 were planes from other units or (more likely) planes in repair units.

Regards,
Andrey