Claim for Spitfire near Canterbury 18 August 1940

[Andy Saunders]

On 18 August 1940 Plt Off Gruszka of 65 Squadron was apparently shot down at around 14.50hrs near Canterbury, Kent, in his Spitfire.

I am trying to establish with a relative degree of certainty (if that is possible!) who his victor might have been. If anyone can provide anything tangible, or any hard and fast likely contender, I'd be pleased to know!

[Franek Grabowski]

Andy, was not there a case of a Me 109 crashing at the same time and place and believed to be the last victim of Gruszka?

[robert]

Hi Andy,

8./JG26 Olt. Gustav Sprick 13.50 Canterbury?
No Bf109 loss connected with combat with 65 Sqn.

Regards

Robert

[Andy Saunders]

Robert

Gruszka was last seen at 14.50 British time.

Presumably the Sprick claim time is Central European Time, which would be 12.50 British time? Am I correct in believing this?

I am trying to get timings clear in my head over this!

[Franek Grabowski]

I see that you have realised your mistake. Anyway, as far as I know, since 10 August British used BST = GMT + 1 hour while Germans - GST = GMT + 2 hours. This will give Sprick's claim at 11.50 GMT and Gruszka's loss at 13.50 GMT. Add to this one hour for British time and two for German one. Apart of that, I have Sprick claiming Hurricane, and it seems Don Caldwell is correct, attributing it to 17 Sqn losses. Robert is again making fuss, in a typical manner.

[robert]

Hi Andy,

and at which time 65 Sqn was airborne? At 14.50 British time no German fighters were in this area.

Regards

Robert

P.S. Mr. Grabowski please stop your stupid tricks and comments. Almost 90% of this forum is already ignoring you so this is useless :-)))

[Andy Saunders]

I have not got the time up-time down for 65 Squadron, but he was lost near Canterbury at 14.50 "whilst pursuing enemy aircraft between Canterbury and Manston". At least, that is according to the Casualty File held by the MOD.

I suppose the possibility of friendly fire exists here?

Something for Brian Cull to comment on, perhaps?

[Andy Saunders]

Originally Posted by Franek Grabowski

I see that you have realised your mistake. Anyway, as far as I know, since 10 August British used BST = GMT + 1 hour while Germans - GST = GMT + 2 hours. This will give Sprick's claim at 11.50 GMT and Gruszka's loss at 13.50 GMT. Add to this one hour for British time and two for German one. Apart of that, I have Sprick claiming Hurricane, and it seems Don Caldwell is correct, attributing it to 17 Sqn losses. Robert is again making fuss, in a typical manner.

Thank you Franek and Robert for your helpful input.

I am just a bit puzzled though, Franek, what it is that Robert is supposed to be making a fuss about?? Sorry. That is totally lost on me. I just asked a question here and didn't intend to start a war!

[robert]

Hi,

I remember seeing a post of German and British time. During some short periods both times were equal. Unfortunately I didn`t save this valuable information`s :-((

Regards

Robert

[Franek Grabowski]

Originally Posted by Andy Saunders

Thank you Franek and Robert for your helpful input.

I am just a bit puzzled though, Franek, what it is that Robert is supposed to be making a fuss about?? Sorry. That is totally lost on me. I just asked a question here and didn't intend to start a war!

Andy, certain person is regularly providing partial, untrue or not verified data as confirmed information, it seems to portray himself as a great researcher. Nevermind.
In regard of Gruszka, I recall the story that a wreck of Messerschmitt was found nearby, and that it was linked to accounts of lone Spitfire dog-fighting against Messerschmitts. I am not sure of the time though, as the wreck was not found, so how would they know so precisely? Good old bible mentions 13.30, and this is possibly time up.
If you look for an excuse for the Bader stir you caused, then I believe this is a wrong case, and there are more better ones.