Austrian FIAT CR.32s

[GaraiB]

Hello Dénes,

I have one picture from ebay, maybe 1 year before was sold.
Nr.153 ex Austrian-German

Kind regards,

Balazs Garai

[Dénes Bernád]

Thanks, Srecko, for your promise. I hoped the info has already been published somewhere.

Balazs, such photos of Austrian CR.32s exists, I have seen quite a few.
My problem is that I do not have the link between the Italian Constr. Nos. and the Austrian A. F. numbers. Also, most importantly, I don't know which ones were re-sold to Hungary.

Finally, what was the logic behind the black Austrian A.F. serial numbers (painted on the fuselage) assigned to the CR.32s?
I would like to know if this has anything to do with the similar black serial numbers painted on early Hungarian CR.32s (valid up to late 1938).

[Stig Jarlevik]

Hi Denes

To help Srecko out the details published in Austria are:
s/n 135 to 179: c/n 418-422, 488-497, 423-427, 499, 501,503,498,500,507,519-520, 524-525, 518, 521, 523, 528, 526, 527, 529-532, 506, 541-542 and 505

Cheers
Stig
PS. Not sure I understand what you mean with the logic behind the black s/n on the Austrian aircraft. I find nothing strange as such, so perhaps you can elaborate a bit?

[Dénes Bernád]

Thanks, Stig, for the info on the Austrian CR.32s. Now, the challenge is to find out which ones were handed over to Hungary later on...

Originally Posted by Stig Jarlevik

Not sure I understand what you mean with the logic behind the black s/n on the Austrian aircraft. I find nothing strange as such, so perhaps you can elaborate a bit?

As for your question, perhaps I did not use the proper word, logic. A better one would have been 'what was the rule behind assigning the air force individual numbers and what was the link to the constr. nos.'?

[Stig Jarlevik]

Hallo again Dénes

I assume you know about this page?
http://www.freeweb.hu/horac/talalat.php?GTA=t97
A also believe you are in a better position to ask those responsible if they have anything further. I have had a bit of a struggle to translate what they say into Swedish....

I am not sure there was any specific logic behind the application of the Dienstnummer in Austria. Mind you I have not studied them to see if there is, so there may well be you know.

Just like in Hungary these Dienstnummer were initially covered up by civil registrations, just like the LüH numbers in Hungary. Nothing strange in that since all nations forbidden to have an airforce in 1919 did the same thing.

Cheers
Stig

[harryfighter]

Hello Denes, hello Stig!

The Austrian Air Force bought 45 "Chirri's" in 1936 to equip the Jagdgeschwader II in Wr.Neustadt. There was no connection between the Werk-Nr. (construction number) from Fiat and the Dienstnummer in Austria. The system of Dienstnummern was the military registration system, the DNr. helps to find out what kind of aircraft is this 1.. means fighter aircraft, 2.. means recce, 3.. is a bomber and so on. Also there is no connection to a civil registration. This was not necessary anymore in 1936! For example the DNr. 165 was a fighter from the type Fiat Cr32 and had the running number 65 in this block, the construction number was 524.
In 1938 the Jagdgeschwader II with the Cr32 became the I/JG135 and the I/JG138. The commander of the I/JG138 was Hptm. Wilfried Müller-Rienzburg, the former commander of the Jagdgeschwader II. The Gruppe was based in Wien-Aspern, therfore the famous enblem "Löwe von Aspern" lion from Aspern of the Deutsche Luftwaffe. This enblem exist still today with the Austrian Air Force, many years with the Draken and now with the Eurofighter of the Überwachungsgeschwader.

There were no Chirri's directly sold from the Austrian Air Force to Hungary but likely later from the Luftwaffe. I don't believe that Hungary used the DNr. for the ex Austrian Cr 32. George Punka states in his booklet "Hungarian Air Force" the registration V.060,.. for 36 ex Austrian aircraft.

In addition the Air Force bought also three Fiat Cr 30 monoposto with the DNr. 183, 184 and 186 and three Fiat Cr 30 biposto with the DNr. 180, 181 and 182.

Best wishes from Austria,

Harald

[Dénes Bernád]

Thanks you, Harald, for the explanation.

In the meantime, I found out that additionally to the 36 CR.32s, 7 CR.20s were probably also sold to Hungary!

This was mentioned in Flieger Revue Extra Nr. 3:
FIAT CR.20bis, Nr. 113, 120, 126, 128, 130, 132 es 133: moeglicher Verkauf nach Ungarn.

Things are getting complicated and fuzzy...

Can anyone confirm these sales?