German Fighter wreck

[Nick Beale]

On the other hand, here are the actual aircraft reported on 5.(F)/123's strength …

On 16 September 1944 (CX/MSS/R312(A),12) only G-5 and G-6 were reported.

On 28 September (CX/MSS/R.323(A),4):

Return dated 28/9 signed Technical Officer:
A/c actual strength: 7
Serviceable: 2

412169 under 22
15220 serviceable
110520 under 52
1105(B% 5)4 under 13
110557 under 52
201501 serviceable
202068 under 41

Crews, actual strength: 11
Ready: 8
Sick: 2
Detached: 1

("under 22" etc. = types of unserviceability)

More G-8s had arrived by 3 October: W.Nr. 201503 and 200412 (CX/MSS/R 328(A),19).

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Many thanks for your highly valued input, Nick !

Given the W.Nr.'s we have thus two WNF built G-8's, W.Nr. 201501 and 202068. Any ideas about what "under 41" does mean ?

In all cases, no chance to link up the plane seen on the picture with one of 5.(F)/123 machines... Any chance for 3./NAGr. 13 or NAGr. 14 to operate in the Lyon area ?

Cheers
Marc

[Xerumbe]

@ Nick: Very useful things. Thank a lot.

@ Marc André: There is no possibility that these units have been used around Lyon (NAGr. 13 & 14).

Personnal theory:
This plane would belong to the SSKaatsch and would probably be a simple G6 coming from the JGr. 200 and which has not yet received its definitive identification marks. There were numerous missions of reconnaissance of this squadron above Lyon, Grenoble and Valence between 27 and 30 August 1944. The Sonder Staffel Kaatsch was created in the emergency and all the planes have not yet received their Identification while performing such missions. If you see an error in my reasoning let me know.

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Thanks for your position, Xerumbe. Can you tell us more about the Sonder Staffel Kaatsch ? I never heard the name of that unit so far.

Cheers
Marc

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by Marc-André Haldimann

Can you tell us more about the Sonder Staffel Kaatsch ? I never heard the name of that unit so far.

Cheers
Marc

So much for my efforts! Try this: http://www.ghostbombers.com/recon/Kaatsch/kaatsch1.html

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by Marc-André Haldimann

Many thanks for your highly valued input, Nick !

Given the W.Nr.'s we have thus two WNF built G-8's, W.Nr. 201501 and 202068. Any ideas about what "under 41" does mean ?

No, it seems there was a number code for reporting everything that could possibly go wrong with an aircraft. I do know that 22 was "away from base" or "attached to another unit".

Any chance for 3./NAGr. 13 or NAGr. 14 to operate in the Lyon area ?

Cheers
Marc

I shouldn't think so because Staffel Kaatsch had been formed specifically to fill a gap in reconnaissance coverage in that area.

[Xerumbe]

Hello dear friends. I come back from a very important interview about the plane we're talking about. Following the various investigations that I carried out in my region to find the truth I was contacted by a gentlemen of the city of Genas this morning. He collects the municipal newspapers which have never ceased to be published, even during the days of fighting of the "Liberation". Here is the story: on 28 August around 11:00 a German single-seater aircraft lands between Meyzieu and Pusignan. The pilot, a young lieutenant named Kehr or Kehrer (or something like that) is treated for a few hours by Mr and Mrs Loison, farmers. He spoke a little bit French and told them that his teammate was shot down in the morning towards Valence and that his plane was hit by bullets. He was forced to land in an emergency.
So here is the plane of the patrol composed of two aircrafts that attack today the fuel depot of "Mirabel and Blacon" (Drôme). During this mission Oblt Theodor Spies was killed by the American anti-aircraft artillery fire. The second plane is seen going north ... Apart from this interesting find, I am personally touched by this news because Herr Spies is none other than my great uncle (which I have never been able to meet with this fact) . That does not give us any more information about this plane, but we now formally know that it belonged to the SSKaatsch.

[Nick Beale]

Thanks for that information — what was the name of the newspaper, by the way?
It's a shame that the aircraft's Werk Nummer is not legible, although it can be seen just forward of the bottom point of the Hakenkreuz.

It is possible that this was W.Nr. 160755, see below:

CX/MSS/R.293(C)

7. First page of report seen by Source addressed to Technical Officer, stamped 1845/29/8:
Strength return, 30/8:

Crews A/c

Total: (B%9) 1(B%3)

Ready: 9 Serv.: 5

Unserviceable a/c: 160755 (smudge) shot up, 163876, 440536 … (rest missing) …

NOTE:Almost certainly to (F) 123 from part F 123 (Dijon).

[Marc-André Haldimann]

Nick,

Sorry, I searched your site but obviously on the wrong spot... And thanks both for your explanations and for your fundamental work.

Xerumbe, thanks for all those details. With Nick's insight, this pretty much settles the case.

Cheers
Marc

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by Xerumbe

This plane would belong to the SSKaatsch and would probably be a simple G6 coming from the JGr. 200 and which has not yet received its definitive identification marks.

So far, I have found no evidence that any Kaatsch aircraft received "definitive identification marks." In known cases they seem to have retained whatever markings they had when they arrived with the Staffel.