Bueligens P-38 kills, disputed

[leonventer]

Hi Artie Bob,

I believe it was the missing 'h' in 'Bueligen' that got Artur's goat.

Leon Venter

[Dénes Bernád]

There is a difference between 'Bühligen' and 'Bueligens'. That's what probably pissed off 'Artur PK', i.e., the repeated usage of the misspelled name even after the proper spelling was pointed out.

I am looking forward to the replies related to his apparent overclaimings.

[Black baron]

One site had it spelled like this.. Doubt the 'n' belongs there.


"Bu-Mann" Kurt Buhlingen

[Ruy Horta]

As a side comment, even some germans favor the oe over ö spelling, for instance WW 1 Ace Oswald Boelcke. I've read in Boelcke's biography (J. Werner) that this is, or at least was, something of a personal preference.

Buehlingen or Bühlingen is the same.

[Ruy Horta]

Didn't the US records have some gaps for the period?

[Jim P.]

My first comment would be that Sprick is hardly a reliable source. Personally, I find his stuff unreadable.Did the LW pilots overclaim? Certainly. Was it intentional deceit or over zealous enthusiasm? Who knows. Most of these guys are dead so, obviously, they ain't talking. Was the this unique to the LW? Hell no. As I recall Fighter Command knew the RAF was overclaiming by about 75% during the BoB, but didn't make anything of it for morale purposes. Everybody overclaimed - as a guess I'd say overall for all combatants you'd find about a 50% overclaiming rate. Get over it. Its a fact. I'm not about to hold it against someone 60 years on because I can refute this or that claim. Of the very few times I've read of a pilot trying to see his claim into the ground, the result was the guy usually got hit in return - Rall is one case I remember. Go read about the AVG if you're really interested in a case of overclaiming.

[keith A]

JG2 do seem to have a reputation for overclaiming. Donald Caldwell hints at it in his books on JG26. There was also the case of some of those JG27 pilots in the desert of 1942...

Its a valid argument that Fighter Command were seriously overclaiming in the latter part of 1941, and in the early part of 1942 but as the time went on there was a closer relationship between claims and losses. The Battle of Britian seems to indicate a 1:3 ratio of actual loss to claim. 74 Squadron, 303 squadron, and in 1941, 452 Squadron, all have serious discrepancies between claims and enemy losses.

For serious overclaiming I think the best example in the Pacific. American and Japanese claims during the air war were occasionally ridiculous. The Japanese air forces were certainly wiped out by late 1944 if claims are true. Likewise the USAAF, and Navy.

German claims over the eastern front would be an interesting debate. Is it reasonable to believe that the Russian air forces were so poor that they succumbed in such numbers to pilots who became early victims when switched to the Western Front? (Kittel, Lang etc.)