Lt Achleitner's last kill 28/08/40

[Jon]

I have just got hold of a copy of Lt Achleitners interrogation report made the day after he was shot down over Herne Bay on 28/08/40.

In it he claims to have shot down a Spitfire and damaged another before being shot down by a third, he was shot down I think by Peter Brothers in a Hurricane so it is possible the Spits were infact Hurricanes. Peter Brothers has Achleitner against a 109 kill in his log book for this date however, a 109 also collided with a Hurricane about the same time...so could be either.
Either way Lt Achleitners war was over.

The combat took place over the Thames Estuary between 4pm and 5pm with Achleitner landing 2 miles north of Herne Bay.

I have looked at my records and can find no definate kills that could be his around these times, can anyone help ?

[Peter Cornwell]

Jon,
I have ACHLEITNER down on 24th August 1940 all other details as per your posting. As you say, it is highly likely that he had been in action with No.32 Squadron Hurricanes. Just another case of ‘Spitfire snobbery’ it would seem.


Three Hurricanes were lost in this engagement: P/O R. E. SMYTHE (V6568) who forced-landed at Shuttlesfield wounded, P/O K. PNIAK baled out over Ottinge, and P/O E. G. A. SEGHERS who baled out over the sea. This relates closely to III./JG3 claims submitted by Lt Leonhard GÖTTMANN & Uffz Josef KEIL which were both for Spitfires but at the correct times of 4.00 pm and 4.15 pm (BST) though ( worryingly) situated much further north over ‘London’ & ‘South London’. So on this evidence, it would appear that ACHLEITNER may well have also scored on this, his last sortie. But exactly who got what I cannot say.


No.32 Squadron filed claims for three 109s down in the sea by GILLMAN, HIGGINS (10 miles off Folkestone) & BROTHERS (10 miles SE of Dover). They also claimed a 109 probable, plus 2 more damaged. In addition to ACHLEITNER, III./JG3 lost Uffz Wilhelm KAISER of 9 Staffel, who forced-landed at Camber at 4.00 pm. Three more 109s returned to France damaged, one of them later being declared a write-off. So not a bad ratio of claims to losses given the standards prevalent at the time.

See Battle of Britain Then & Now & Blitz Then & Now Volume 1 & Prien 4/1.

[Jon]

Hi Peter.

Thanks for your very informative answer, my error he was shot down on the 24th August not the 28th as i have stated.
I also have the RNLI records for this date and it would appear Achleitner definatley went into the sea near Herne Bay.
I suppose that at great height and at speed it was not very easy for a pilot to log the exact area for a kill or combat.
Also a question i have never had a good response too is that in the heat of combat a pilot surely would not have had time to log the time physically or mentally let alone the exact location..."Over London" for example... a big place we know but at 20.000ft not so big ? so maybe they logged it after the event on the way home in safe skies?

Regards
Jon

[Peter Cornwell]

Jon,

I'm tickled by the mental picture of pilots doing their paperwork on their way back to base - should have a pencil tray fitted in the cockpit. There can be any number of possible explanations for contradictions of this sort in respective sources. London was probably destination for the sortie and they met No.32 Squadron en-route. When it came to doing the paperwork later, locations could often be fairly general.

[Franek Grabowski]

Gents
Reports were as accurate as lazy was IO, otherwise locations on a header of a report were interception point area or as noted general area of combat. The one must always check what is in the narrative, because there are usually substantial differencies.
More interestingly, there is account of Pniak of very this sortie, it is available in Poles in defence of Britain. Also, am I not wrong, and did 501 took part in the very same interception?

[Peter Cornwell]

Franek,

Just so, no argument. No.501 Sqdn were patrolling Dover that afternoon and engaged about 30 minutes earlier over north Kent - Gravesend area I believe.