Help with early nightfighter loss

[MW Giles]

Michael Balss in Deutsche Nachtjagd Personalverluste in Ausbildung und Einsatz - fliegendes Personal lists the Schwarz crew lost on the night of 28/29.06.40 and the aircraft as a Bf110 C-4 G9+GK

I also have (but cannot find source at moment) that it was coned in same searchlights as bomber. Hit by return fire

That same night F/O P Espley of 58 Sqn in Whitley V N1469 H claimed a Bf110 Damaged at 8,000ft near Eindhoven

Adding 2+2 will probably give us 16,000,000 but that is what I can add

Regards

Martin

[Peter Cornwell]

Martin,

Many thanks for the input. The SCHWARZ crew were definitely reported flying a Do17 when brought down on 28/29 June 1940 which contradicts the information from Michael Balss. But the No.58 Squadron Whitley reference is certainly worth recording as a distinct possibility. Thanks.

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Larry,

Interestingly enough, the unpublished history mentions that the crew Schwarz, Palm and Born were awarded the EK 1 but "that despite the efforts of the doctors, Fw. Born died of his wounds in a Lazarett in Düsseldorf". If you look in Wolfgang Falcks book Falkenjahre, this EK 1 ceremony is also mentioned.

If the unpublished history is right about Grefrath (this location is also given in the Gen.Qm. loss list), then the location should not have been 3km east of Mönchen-Gladbach but at least 5km NNW of Mönchen-Gladbach.

In the Gen.Qm. loss list the unit is given as I./ZG 1 which to my opinion is a more correct version because the I./ZG 1 had left behind the 1./ZG 1 and 2nd FBK in Le Havre, when the other Staffeln were directed to Düsseldorf for their new nightfighting task.

All the best, Marcel

[Peter Cornwell]

Marcel,

I do not find Grefrath cited in the QMG Returns. Can you please point me to this reference ? Many thanks.

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Peter,

You are right, my mistake: the QMG Returns report of 1 July 1940, #4 says 'Mönchen-Gladbach, Luftkampf' but the unpublished history - written in WW2 - refers to the smaller town of Grefrath, this seems to be more precise than the larger (and more obvious) town Mönchen-Gladbach.

All the best, Marcel

[Theo Boiten]

Dear all,

An interesting sideline to these early Nachtjagd experiments is a story from the I./NJG1 history that Marcel mentions, and I quote: The first cruel setback inflicted on the Gruppe was the loss of Feldwebel Thier who was shot down near Paderborn by a Bf110 flying a lone night fighting sortie. It appeared that Thier had suffered radio failure and as there was zero ground visibility at Rhein, he had elected correctly to divert to Paderborn. With his navigation lights illuminated he found himself easy prey for a pilot doing a little "moonlighting" in the air. An over-ambitious single-engine pilot from the field at Paderborn was also airborne on his own initiative on a "night-fighting" sortie; as ever in such cases his first and only victim proved to be the brave crew of one of our own aircraft in difficulty.

Does anyone have the right date to this incident & the name of the 'friendly fighter' who shot down Thier?

Cheers, Theo

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Theo,

It will not surprise you that this loss appears in "the mother of all obscure Luftwaffe files"... the GQM Luftwaffe losses reel 1: 23 June 1940

All the best, Marcel

[Theo Boiten]

Hi Marcel,

Cheers & thanks for this pointer -would you be so kind as to post the details on the loss of Fw. Thier, or send me a PM (or an email to my private address theoboitenATversatel.nl AT = @) with these details?

Perhaps you, or any other readers, can also supply me with details on the identity of a Ju88 that was shot down in error by two Nachtjäger of 1./NJG1 on 30 September - 1 October 1940 (the Junkers crew baled out safely but there still may be a Verlustmeldung of the aircraft?):

Fw. Kollak and Oblt. Griese 1./NJG1 2-mot near Duisburg 01.00 Ju88

Thanks, Theo

[Matti Salonen]

Maybe this is your Ju 88:
1940-10-01, 9./KG 30, Ju 88A-1, (88)5043, 4D+FZ, Bei Kloppenburg, Abschuß durch eigene Nachtjäger. Bruch 100 %. Besatzung mit Fallschirm abgesprungen.

Matti

[Theo Boiten]

Hi Matti,

This sure looks like the one we're looking for! All the details seem to fit, although I can't find a place called 'Kloppenburg' in the Duisburg area, where the two Nachtjäger involved in the incident recorded the location where their 'adversary' came down. Apparently, the crew of the Ju88, which were held in searchlights, did not fire the right colours of the day and were therefore engaged by the two 'friendly' fighters..

Cheers, Theo