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  #1  
Old 17th January 2010, 16:00
janviotta janviotta is offline
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Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

hello

I am looking for mission reports for the 364th FG/383rd FS for September 23rd 1944.

The background to this request is a search into the fate of Lt Norman Bettin of the 383rd FS, whom it is believed was shot down by AA on September 23rd, 1944, in the vicinity of Apeldoorn, the Netherlands, although this could also be September 28th. His date of death is given as Oct 7th, 1944. No MACR is known. We are looking for confirmation of the date of his loss.

Any help is apreciated!
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  #2  
Old 17th January 2010, 16:26
Frank Olynyk Frank Olynyk is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

According to the Military records section of Ancestry.com, 1st Lt Norman F Bettin, O752097, was killed on Oct 7, 1944, and is buried in Margraten Permanent Cemetary, grave number c 19 30.

No MACR found on Footnote.com, but he did prepare the MACR for another pilot lost on Sept 17, 1944 (#8788).

Frank.
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  #3  
Old 18th January 2010, 05:03
mhuxt mhuxt is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

A file listing losses over Holland (google on 1944 sec_tcm5-7285 ) also gives 7 October as the date, at Otterlo, about 18km SW of Apeldoorn.
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Old 18th January 2010, 18:54
Horst Weber Horst Weber is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

Quote:
Originally Posted by janviotta View Post
hello

I am looking for mission reports for the 364th FG/383rd FS for September 23rd 1944.

The background to this request is a search into the fate of Lt Norman Bettin of the 383rd FS, whom it is believed was shot down by AA on September 23rd, 1944, in the vicinity of Apeldoorn, the Netherlands, although this could also be September 28th. His date of death is given as Oct 7th, 1944. No MACR is known. We are looking for confirmation of the date of his loss.

Any help is apreciated!
Good evening !

364th FG Mission No. 208 reports, that Norman F. Bettin's a/c was hit by flak on September 23rd, 1944, over Arnhem airfield and was obviously killed
in the resulting crash.

In the LGK-reports for this day is an entry at 17:30 hrs, which reports the downing of a "Mustang 0782 ? near Apeldoorn, 30 km NW Wesel"
filed under J-report # 2181.

Maybe this can be your trace. On my opinion, the mission-date was Sept 23rd and the day of death was Oct 7th. All other ideas seem currently not realistic.

All the best !

Horst Weber
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Old 18th January 2010, 20:43
karl lusink karl lusink is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horst Weber View Post
Good evening !

364th FG Mission No. 208 reports, that Norman F. Bettin's a/c was hit by flak on September 23rd, 1944, over Arnhem airfield and was obviously killed
in the resulting crash.

In the LGK-reports for this day is an entry at 17:30 hrs, which reports the downing of a "Mustang 0782 ? near Apeldoorn, 30 km NW Wesel"
filed under J-report # 2181.

Maybe this can be your trace. On my opinion, the mission-date was Sept 23rd and the day of death was Oct 7th. All other ideas seem currently not realistic.

All the best !

Horst Weber
Hello,
Report J-2181 is for Capt. Clarence Oscar JOHNSON 23-09-1944
Crash:SW of Appeldorn, at Neu Louisendorf/Totenhügel, Germany.
Buried at Kalkar, grave 2.
Bettin was buried in OTTERLO General Cemetery.
Now Margraten:C-19-30
Day of Death oct 7, 1944
Maybe he died of wounds????
Regards
Karl Lusink
ARGA
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Old 20th January 2010, 19:46
shooshoobaby shooshoobaby is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

Jan -
From : 8th AF Day to Day Operations by Kent Miller
9/23/44 -
Lt. Norman F. Bettin KIA
383d Sq.
Hit by Flak near Arnheim
8th AF Roll of Honor Lists DOD 10/7/44
--------------------------------
9/23/44 -
Lt. Clyde Voss - MIA , Evaded
383d Sq.
Hit by Flak near Apeldoorn
P - 51 # 44-13971 N2 D " Priss IV "
Mike
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  #7  
Old 20th January 2010, 20:58
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Bas Maathuis Bas Maathuis is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

According to the database of the Dutch Airwar Studygroup, Lt. C.K. Voss' P-51, 44-13971 came down at Nederlangbroek (Municipality Langbroek) on the 23th september 1944.

Lt. N.F. Bettin O-752097 was hit by Flak during a strafing mission on Deelen Airfield on the 7th october 1944, and crashed in the vicinity. Buried at Otterlo, community of Ede.
The date of his death is confirmed in the Ede Archive.
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Bas Maathuis

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Dutch Airwar Studygroup

http://www.luchtoorlogboventwente.nl/homepage.php
In Dutch only...

Last edited by Bas Maathuis; 20th January 2010 at 20:58. Reason: typo
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Old 20th January 2010, 23:16
karl lusink karl lusink is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

Lt. N.F. Bettin O-752097 was hit by Flak during a strafing mission on Deelen Airfield on the 7th october 1944, and crashed in the vicinity. Buried at Otterlo, community of Ede.
The date of his death is confirmed in the Ede Archive.[/quote]

Hello Bas.
What is your source for "hit by flak during a strafing mission on Deelen airfield on the 7th of october 1944" ?
8th USAAF reported no loss for 364 FG that day.
8th USAAF reported the loss of 2 364 FG P-51's on 23-09-1944
I know that 364 FG was in the Arnhem area 23-09-1944.
Date of death is indeed oct 7, 1944.
Who is in possession of the mission report for 23/09/44?
Regards
Karl Lusink
ARGA
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  #9  
Old 21st January 2010, 19:57
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Bas Maathuis Bas Maathuis is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

Karl,

Info from Casualty Report by Jan Hey.
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Kind regards,

Bas Maathuis

Coordinator of the Loss Register of the
Dutch Airwar Studygroup

http://www.luchtoorlogboventwente.nl/homepage.php
In Dutch only...
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  #10  
Old 21st January 2010, 22:25
janviotta janviotta is offline
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Re: Mission reports 364th FG/383rd FS September 23rd 1944/ Norm Bettin KIA

thank you all for your help. I have now the mission reports and Lt Bettin was indeed lost on Sept 23rd, 1944. Hit by flak over Deelen Airfield at 300 ft and exploded on the ground. The date of death of Oct 7th is still a mystery... It is possible that he died of wounds on that date, or that his body wasn't found until the 7th. I beleive the former, but am still looking into this..
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