Spitfire collision & other question,s

[Alex Smart]

Hello,
A collision of two Spitfires on the 9th July 1942
According to AB book BA100 to BZ999 pub 2006.
BM323 - 19 - collided with BM539 and crashed Millbank Farm, Newchurch, Kent 9.7.1943;DBF. F/Lt. P. H. Bell killed.
BM539 - 19 - collided with BM323 and crashlanded near Newchurch, Kent. 9.7.1943.
Who was the pilot of BM539 and did he survive please ?

1st April 1942
AD377 - 19 - Force landed in shallows (?) Hickling Broad, near Potter Heigham, Norfolk. DBR. Who was its pilot please ?

26th April 1942
Sgt. Royer's aircraft was damaged by flak. Was BL316 ( Damaged on sweep 26.4.42; sent to C.Bromwich and SOC) Royer's a/c that day please ?

Who were the pilots of -
AD500 on 15th November 1941. Bellylanded & hit hedge 1m NW of Matlask. DBR.
and
AD476 on 16th May 1942. Hit Bowser while taxiing at Perranporth. DBR.
Did they survive the landings ?

Sqdn Ldr B. J. E. Lane DFC, 13th ( or was it the 19th ?) December 1942, what was the serial number of his Spitfire please ? AR612 of 167 Sqdn has been recorded.

Thanks
Alex

[Allan125]

Hi Alex

From the 125 Airfield ORB 9/7/43

Ramrod 127.This was the first operational show from 125 Airfield. 19 and 132 squadrons were detailed as escort to 12 Mitchells bombing St. Omer marshalling yards. Bombing results were reported as fair. As the machines were returning to base F/Lt Bell of 19 sqdn. collided with S/Ldr Ekins. S/Ldr Ekins baled out and was safe. F/Lt Bell was killed. In spite of the un-favourable weather conditions the health of the unit remainded good.

Hope this helps - S/Ldr V H Ekins remained as OC 19 Squadron until November 1943.

cheers

Allan

[Alex Smart]

Thanks Allan,
S/Ldr Ekins must have been in BM539 then.
Alex

[Allan125]

Hi Alex

The 125 Airfield ORB (Form 540 only) does not list any serials at all between June 1943 - July 1945, they would be, possibly, listed in the Form 541 of the relevant squadrons.

However, as we are all aware, you either get serials or individual letters, but very rarely both in a Form 541 - sometimes you just get lucky if you can find a pilot's logbook with both, but they are also as rare as hens teeth!!

However, see also:

BM323 from http://www.spitfires.ukf.net/p026.htm


BM323 Vb CBAF M45 FF 26-3-42 12MU 29-3-42 313S 11-4-42 154S 3-6-42 DeH 29-10-42 485S 11-4-43 19S Collided with BM539 on return from escorting Mitchells to St.Omer nr Newchurch Kent 9-7-43 FH262.25 F/Lt P H Bell killed in one aircraft

BM539 from http://www.spitfires.ukf.net/p027.htm

BM539 Vb CBAF M45 LFVb 12MU 20-4-42 242S 16-6-42 FACB 27-9-42 ASTH 610S 9-4-43 R-R 18-4-43 mods 485S 6-5-43 R-R 20-5-43 inspection 19S 1-7-43 air collision with BM323 crashed nr 125SLG Newchurch Kent CE 9-7-43 FH136.45

By virtue of the report above stating "F/Lt P H Bell killed in one aircraft", but not stating which, what does the 19 Squadron ORB have to say about this incident, as that should confirm the entry in the AB publication?

cheers

Allan

[Alex Smart]

Hello Allan,
And just to confuse -
Derek Palmer's book has on page 226
"Flight Lieutenant Bell and the CO collided rendering both their aircraft uncontrollable. Squadron Leader Ekins baled out immediately and effected a safe landing bruising his legs and cutting his hands. Flight Lieutenant P. H. Bell was not so fortunate, his aircraft (BL852) headed straight towards the ground from 1500 feet where the collision occurred. He baled out but his parachute failed to open in time to save him".
AB has for BL852 -
402/312/403/401/416/19/315 - Engine cut; crashed during attempted bellylanding,Ballyhalbert 8.7.43.
So this a/c met its end with 315 Sqn not 19 .Spitfire the History confirms this as does the Polish Squadrons Remembered web site "8 July. Spitfire IX BL852 (PK-?) F/Sgt F. Malczewski. Flying accident. Pilot injured. SOC."
N.R. Franks has in FCL vol 2 (these machines were BM323 and BM539).
Spitfire the History has -
BM323 no mention of 19 Sqn, only "CE ops 9-7 FH262.25".
BM539 "19S 1-7 air coll with BM323 cd nr 125 SLG CE 9-7 FH136.45".
So question of who was in which a/c remains open.
Alex

[Allan125]

Hi Alex

Thanks for the further information - So much for accurate data recording !!!

I see you haven't put what is in the 19 Squadron Forms 540/541?

Not surprisingly we don't accept servicing cards, log books or 541's as being 100% accurate - after all they were written up at the time, and people were probably quite happy with them, when one was lost a replacement turned up - but 70 years later along we come and demand 100% accuracy!!

cheers

Allan

[Observer1940]

Hello Alex

The Pilot's Log Book of S/Ldr B.J.E. Lane is AIR 4/58 at TNA, Kew.

"S/Ldr B.J.E. Lane, Remarks: Battle of Britain Pilot; early night fighter operations." ... 1938 Feb. - 1942 Dec.

Regards Mark

[Alex Smart]

Hello Allan and Mark,
Thank you both for your help, it is mostwelcome.
Allan, do you have copies of the forms you mention ?

Still needed are details of the following -
1st April 1942
AD377 - 19 - Force landed in shallows (?) Hickling Broad, near Potter Heigham, Norfolk. DBR. Who was its pilot please ?

26th April 1942
Sgt. Royer's aircraft was damaged by flak. Was BL316 ( Damaged on sweep 26.4.42; sent to C.Bromwich and SOC) Royer's a/c that day please ?

Who were the pilots of -
AD500 on 15th November 1941. Bellylanded & hit hedge 1m NW of Matlask. DBR.
and
AD476 on 16th May 1942. Hit Bowser while taxiing at Perranporth. DBR.
Did they survive the landings ?

Thanks
Alex

[Allan125]

Hi Alex

I don't hold the Form 540/541 for 19 Squadron at all - all I hold is the complete 125 Airfield/Wing ORB between 24 June '43 - 14 July '45, and 19 Squadron was only part of 125 Airfield for a relatively short period, as they joined the airfield when formed on 24 June 1943, and left at 13.30 on 17 August 1943.

cheers

Allan