Any ex-LW adviser for 1969 BofB film?

[Bombphoon]

....Stuka making a crash landing on the radar station more or less intact; aircraft exploding in mid air with the wings just falling off; Heinkel model crashing into the sea trailing the radio-control wire aerial; the fires of the London Blitz glowing like someone was switching them on and off, plus moving around over London as they were superimposed; THAT 1960's front door and doorbell; no Do17s, Ju88s, Me110's etc; Susannah York's awful 1960's haircut and make-up etc etc etc...

...we could all pick dozens more faults with the film but I still quite happily watch it, because it was made for all the right reasons as a tribute to The Few and accept its shortcomings because there was no CGI at the time. There has also never been a film or book written that does not have mistakes in it.

Seeing as the film industry has run out of new ideas and rehashes old favourites all the time, perhaps they could do something useful and remake BoB with CGI and more accurate detail?

The extras on the DVD show that Galland was the Luftwaffe advisor and the producers had rows with him about various issues e.g. Galland claimed that Luftwaffe pilots never machine-gunned bailed out RAF pilots: the producers said they had evidence they did. It also says that the film cost so much to make, they barely made a penny, even possibly making a loss.

[Nick Beale]

Originally Posted by Bombphoon

...we could all pick dozens more faults with the film but I am still quite happily watch it, because...

… of the sequences where a formation of Spits peels off into a dive — they are such a beautiful sight.

Actually — doorbell aside — I thought the film did a pretty good job with the means at its disposal. The overall story was reasonably faithful to history with lots of recognisable incidents.

GCI isn't the answer to everything either, not when it's combined with ignorance of history. There was that (Spielberg?) TV mini-series where beautifully rendered Bf 109 Es (complete with tail struts) were attacking B-17s. Or "Enemy at the Gates" where each (otherwise believable) Ju 87 had three underwing racks loaded with long sleek bombs more suited to an F-15E Strike Eagle. Or "Dr Who: The Empty Child" where the He 111s flew over in close formation — at night!

What I could never understand are the scenes of air attack in "Das Boot" — why didn't they just get some film of the FAA's Swordfish and cut it in?

Highly commended: Ian McKellen's "Richard the Third", set in the 1930s–40s with a real Blenheim composited into one of the battles.

[Doug Stankey]

I examined the Mosley book more carefully and the critical issue that Galland was concerned with was whether or not Kesselring was to give a "Nazi" salute while greeting Göring at a train station. While the director, Guy Hamilton, wanted to include it as a dramatic point, it was historically false and looked like a caricature. Galland threatened to walk off the picture and give the film bad publicity unless the matter was corrected. He apparently won because in the scene, the actor depicting Kesselring gives the correct military salute! (at about 1 hour and 24 minutes into the film).

Has anyone noticed the big hill in the background? I m sure that Pas de Calais had nothing like that!


Looking at the credits, I see that the "German Technical and Tactical Advisors" were listed as:
Adolf Galland
Col. Hans Brustellin
Maj. Franz Frodl

So that answers the question insofar as the "official " ex-Luftwaffe advisors are concerned.

For the sake of completeness, here is what we have on these last two fellows:

BRUSTELLIN, Hans-Heinrich. 01.04.37 Oblt., appt Staka 3./JG 135 (to 14.03.38). 01.04.38 appt Staka 1./JG 138. 01.11.38 appt Staka 1/JG 134. 15.07.39 Hptm., in I./JG 76, appt Kdr. I./JG 51 (to 17.10.40) and concurrently Kdt. Fl.H. Adlershof (Berlin-Johannistal) (to 11.39). 15.08.40 WIA – in Bf 109 E-4 shot down and crash landed in the vicinity of Pihen/10.6 km SSW of Calais. 18.10.40 Hptm., appt Kdr. I./JG 53 (to 31.05.41). 01.01.42 promo to Maj. 02.42 Maj., in Stab/Gen.d.Jagdflieger (to 07.05.43). 07.05.43 trf to X. Fliegerkorps for further assignment. 15.09.43 Maj., appt Jagdfliegerführer Ostpreussen (to 31.03.44). 29.09.44 Obstlt., appt Kommodore JG 106 (to 02.45).

FRODL, Franz. 1943 Oblt., appt Staka Kampfstaffel/Erprobungskdo. 25 (to 1944).

[young knobby]

Originally Posted by Ruy Horta

Didn't Galland pull out because of his disagreements with the makers of the film (on various issues including the use of the Nazi salute).

That is my understanding. The producers wanted the three Luftwaffe Pilots who met Goring off the train to give the Nazi salute, Galland insisted that it never happened.

[tcolvin]

And surely Galland was mis-remembering.

Hitler famously said he had a reactionary Army, a Christian Navy but a National Socialist Air Force, and Galland was for years one of Hitler's favourites.

Galland reciprocated the enthusiasm, which was probably the main reason he lasted for three years as General der Jagdflieger in spite of his hedonism, impatience, blunt language, failures (eg in Sicily), and Goering's antagonism.

And by the way, what exactly was Galland doing illegally in Argentina after his unconditional release by the denazification board in May 1947?

His refusal to explain that paralelled the information gap on his political views and actions during the war.
We simply don't know enough to accept his statement they didn't give the Hitlergruss.



Tony

[Ruy Horta]

Well in 1940 that was indeed not the standard military nor Luftwaffe salute, to that extend it would be unprofessional for a soldier to do so.

Of course that doesn't mean it wasn't done before before july 44, but it was just not "military" to do so.

Therefor unless you have proof that they did use the Nazi salute, it is more likely they didn't.

For all his popularity I always thought it interesting that Galland wasn't part of the reemerging post war Luftwaffe, while many others like Steinhoff were. Not to cast the first stone, but Galland was probably unfitting for high command (like so many in the Nazi era turned out to be).

[Ruy Horta]

Originally Posted by tcolvin

And surely Galland was mis-remembering.
Hitler famously said he had a reactionary Army, a Christian Navy but a National Socialist Air Force, and Galland was for years one of Hitler's favourites.

That wasn't an original thought.

In modern german history:

The Army was Prussian first and foremost and loyal to the King of Prussia
The Navy was Imperial and loyal to the Kaiser and the Empire.

The Air Force as in independent arm was "National Socialist" and it is hard to argue that it was not, both in birth and generation of men.

Of course with the other arms this distinction became less clear with the junior cadre of officers, but the senior generation was still embedded in these traditions.

One of Hitlers biggest coups in his career was winning support of the army, he had tamed his most powerful and influential of adversaries, it ranks there with bluffing the Anglo-French into inaction during the Czech and later Polish adventures.

[tcolvin]

Michulec and Caldwell believe Galland was offered the post of Bundesluftwaffe Inspector (Commander), which he would not accept, but because of his activities during the war, and more importantly because of 'unsavoury connotations associated with his illegal flight to Argentina', his appointment to head the Bundesluftwaffe, which he wanted, was politically unacceptable. So it went to the safe Josef Kammhuber.

On the matter of taming the army, it was surely only FDR and Churchill's 'Unconditional Surrender' that achieved this for Hitler and Goebbels. If the Allies had offered peace terms, Hitler would have been liquidated in 1943.

Tony

[tcolvin]

Pentathlon gold medallist, colleague of Galland, and serving LW officer, Gotthard Handrick, saw fit to give the Hitlergruss on the Olympic podium in 1936.
Surely he would not have done so had it been 'unprofessional'?

I believe the Hitlergruss was voluntary.
So it is quite possible that the ultra-keen Galland would have given the Hitlergruss at an historically important point in 1940 when all believed German victory was inevitable, and, more importantly, the news photographers were present to record it.

The Italian Silvano Abba also unsurprisingly gave the Hitlergruss, while the American Charles Leonard correctly saluted.

Tony

[tcolvin]

I misunderstood; Handrick was actually saluting Hitler in person. Absent Hitler he would have saluted like Leonard, and so would Kesselring in 1940.
Galland was right to object to Guy Hamilton's 'Hollywood Moment' in BofB.

Tony