Luftwaffe rescue buoys

[Franek Grabowski]

Peter

Originally Posted by Peter Spoden

"There were also chivalrous actions from aviators on both sides - English bombers whose target was obscured while on the bombing run did not always salvo their cargoes over an already blazing city indisciminately but sought out alternative targets, putting their own lives in heightened danger.

The one may find such entries in documents but the reasoning had nothing to chivalry. If the target was ablaze it was a good reason to set fire elsewhere. Otherwise in the early period there were several problems with accuracy of attacks, crews being unable to find proper targets without navigation aids, or not willing to attack heavily defended cities. This resulted with confirming photographs being introduced. Then, if the target was obscured, photos would not show it and the mission will not be credited to the crew.

Or German nightfighters who aimed for the wings of the bomber when opening fire, giving the RAF crews time to prepare to bale out."

Explosion of fumes would not give much time to evacuate. Most of crews taking part in the Warsaw Airlift and shot down by fighters of NJG6 and NJG 101 did not survive.

Chris

There is also the amazing Georg-Peter Eder whose personal chivalry is illustrated here:

Eder was a hero of several such stories, but as far as I know, neither of them could have been confirmed. I recall reading that the story of Johnson's flight was a fake, just the same as the story of a ghost P-40.

Very best wishes to both of you

[ChrisS]

Aw Franek you've gone and ruined my Christmas now! I thought I'd found a 'nice Nazi'. Oh well...............

Happy New Year to you!

Chris

[Brian Bines]

Was not the incident when Eder was shot down and wounded in 1944 when he was giving Michal Gladych the chance to land his damaged P-47 on a Luftwaffe airfield true. As Gladych was in front in the landing pattern it was reported he opened fire causing the airfield Flak to open up hitting Eders Fw 190. Several reports state the incident was verified when Eder and Gladych met up post war and was an article in the RAF Flying Review magazine in the 1950's,

All the best for the New year,

Brian Bines

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Franek Grabowski

The one may find such entries in documents but the reasoning had nothing to chivalry.

Originally Posted by Franek Grabowski

There chivalry stopped already during WWI, and there was no chivalry at all during WWII.

And you know this how? As an historian you should know better than making sweeping statements such as this. Comments like this are poor history and degrading to the few combatants who did follow their heart and not their gut.

[robert]

Hi,

he just know everything. He is a master.

Regards

Robert

[Franek Grabowski]

Originally Posted by Brian Bines

Thanks Franek, are there any known Luftwaffe losses which link to Gladych's claims for this incident

Brian
I have not researched this particular combat, but I think there was some mess in the air involving several German losses. I think JG1 fought in the area.

Originally Posted by Adam

And you know this how? As an historian you should know better than making sweeping statements such as this. Comments like this are poor history and degrading to the few combatants who did follow their heart and not their gut.

Adam
Please, find me any examples of the chivalry in the air that can be verified through the period documents. I do not mean here generosity towards prisoners, which happened indeed. Deliberate attacks on purely civilian targets or strafing of airmen on parachutes started on the very first day of the war, and it worsened in time.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Franek Grabowski

Adam
Please, find me any examples of the chivalry in the air that can be verified through the period documents. I do not mean here generosity towards prisoners, which happened indeed. Deliberate attacks on purely civilian targets or strafing of airmen on parachutes started on the very first day of the war, and it worsened in time.

You're the one claiming there was no chivalry, period. Ergo, you're the one required to submit proof. Simply because you don't know of any instances put on paper or do not believe the word of veterans, does not mean that such never happened.

[Franek Grabowski]

Originally Posted by Adam

You're the one claiming there was no chivalry, period. Ergo, you're the one required to submit proof. Simply because you don't know of any instances put on paper or do not believe the word of veterans, does not mean that such never happened.

The one cannot prove something that does not exist. It is logic. And I do not believe any statements that cannot be corroborated, be it coming from veterans or anybody else.

[Brian]

Now, now Franek and Adam - it's God here. Do I exist?

Cheers
God

[Jan vd Heuvel]

Hi Alex,

here is the British Rescue buoy.

From the wartime book "Briitain's Wonderful Air Force".

Regards,
Jan