355 FG engagements w/experten

[Richard Mills]

Originally Posted by Leo Etgen

Hello guys

Two quick additions to Bill's list:

Steinke: on 29 April 1944 in Bf 109 G-6 (W.Nr. 440 266) crashed 1 kilometer southwest Magdeburg
Schmidt: on 3 August 1944 in Fw 190 A-8/R8 (W.Nr. 670 777) in aerial combat (unknown location)

This information from Prien's IV./JG 3 volume.

Horrido!

Leo

Gents

I am interested in finding any information I can concerning Rolf Steinke of 12./JG3 as I am about to purchase his award documents.

Can I take it from the information in this thread that Steinke was shot down and killed by a USAF pilot of the 355 Fighter Group?

If this is indeed the case, is there any way of putting a name to this USAF pilot?

Any help or pointers in the right direction really will be very well received.

Hopeful in anticipation.

Regards Richard.

[kb]

Originally Posted by drgondog

Eric - thanks. It was a typo - you had already given me the info and my brain misfired from my notes..

I also caught another problem - I forgot that 9,10, 11 and 12 staffels in JG26 were III (nor IV) /JG26.

From the order of battle it seems that only IV/JG were equipped with Fw190's - every of ther unit but ZG26 (110G's) were Me109G's..

Bill

This appears to be an old thread but a note.

On 24 April IV/JG3 was still equipped with ME109s; it didn't convert to the FW190 until mid-May; the 190s encountered were almost certainly from Sturmstaffel 1 (which listed loss of 1-Uffz Heinz Steffen). II/JG1 was engaged around Strasbourg-Hagenau around 1245 and lost two 190s.

[kb]

Originally Posted by Richard Mills

Gents

I am interested in finding any information I can concerning Rolf Steinke of 12./JG3 as I am about to purchase his award documents.

Can I take it from the information in this thread that Steinke was shot down and killed by a USAF pilot of the 355 Fighter Group?

If this is indeed the case, is there any way of putting a name to this USAF pilot?

Any help or pointers in the right direction really will be very well received.

Hopeful in anticipation.

Regards Richard.

Re 29 April the 355th filed one claim on this date, by ace Henry Brown over a 109 near Brunswick at 1145; Steinke went down roughly two hours later.

Other P51 groups:
4th FG filed no aerial claims (over fighters).
352nd filed two, 1-109 and 1-190; I don't have location data.
355th per above
363rd (9th AF P51 squadron) filed no claims
357th filed no claims

The only other P51 equipped group in the ETO at this time was 354th FG, but unfortunately I have no info on their activities this day. I'd lay odds that the 354th is the outfit that shot down Steinke.

[Leo Etgen]

Hi guys

Here are additional details of the losses concerning a couple of the pilots that Bill listed in his opening post. I hope this information is still useful after all the time that has passed since then!

Sigmund: in Bf 110 G-4 "D5 + AD" (W.Nr. 5560) southwest of Göttingen along with Bordfunker Feldwebel Hugo Bauer and Bordschütze Unteroffizier Johannes Dittrich
Mertens: in Bf 109 G-6 "White 1" (W.Nr. 161 358) over Andernach after ramming a B-24 four-engined bomber, bailed out wounded
Segatz: in Fw 190 A-7 "White 23" (W.Nr. 430 315) south of Luckau by fighters
Harloff: in Bf 109 G-6 (W.Nr. 16 527) over Grosskitzighofen by P-38 twin-engined fighters
Roisch: on 28 July 1943 in Bf 109 G-6 (W.Nr. 15 411) over Lexmond, southwest of Vianen

Horrido!

Leo

[kb]

Originally Posted by Leo Etgen

Roisch: on 28 July 1943 in Bf 109 G-6 (W.Nr. 15 411) over Lexmond, southwest of Vianen

Roisch was almost certainly downed by 4th FG.

Lt. Duane Beeson- 1 ME109 1210-1220 Westhooft-Emmerich area
Capt Roy Evans- 1 ME109 1155 15mi (25km) w of Arnhem
Capt Carl Miley- 1 ME109 1200 east of Rotterdam

[kb]

Originally Posted by Leo Etgen

Segatz: in Fw 190 A-7 "White 23" (W.Nr. 430 315) south of Luckau by fighters

Interesting report/possible link from 363rd FG pilot Morton Kammerlohr

"We were a little southwest of Berlin when the bombers we escorted started their bomb run...we had started our climb, when he (1stLt Frank O'Connor) called me again to alert me of a FW190 at 12 oclock high and for me to serve as a decoy by turning in front of him to get his attention, so he could get on his tail. It worked perfectly; when O'Connor was ready to blow him away, he told me to make a hard left turn. The FockeWulf pilot didn't know what hit him; down it went..."

Lt O'Connor's claim is listed as "50 miles (75Km) sw of Berlin".

[drgondog]

Originally Posted by Richard Mills

Gents

I am interested in finding any information I can concerning Rolf Steinke of 12./JG3 as I am about to purchase his award documents.

Can I take it from the information in this thread that Steinke was shot down and killed by a USAF pilot of the 355 Fighter Group?

If this is indeed the case, is there any way of putting a name to this USAF pilot?

Any help or pointers in the right direction really will be very well received.

Hopeful in anticipation.

Regards Richard.

Richard - I did not see this until today.

No, not likely a 355th pilot - more likely a 352nd FG score in the s. Haldensleben area (Me 109) by Cpt E.L. Abbot. The 354th FG got their scores in the Gardelegen to Brandenburg axis so they were further north and escorting the 2nd BD B-24s.

Equally probable - downed by B-17 in Magdeburg area.

[drgondog]

Originally Posted by kb

This appears to be an old thread but a note.

On 24 April IV/JG3 was still equipped with ME109s; it didn't convert to the FW190 until mid-May; the 190s encountered were almost certainly from Sturmstaffel 1 (which listed loss of 1-Uffz Heinz Steffen). II/JG1 was engaged around Strasbourg-Hagenau around 1245 and lost two 190s.

You are right about IV/JG3 still flying 109s..

FYI - The 1245 encounters were JG1 and JG 11 along the Frankfurt-Worms axis (and Mannheim to Ludwigshafen) - all 4th FG Mustangs.

Sturmstaffel 1 (Steffen) Fw 190 was lost to LtC Dix of 355th ~ 1320 in the general Burgheim area. Another Sturm Fw190 was damaged by 355th n. Munich. Apparently Steffen saluted Dix when he bailed out.

Dix is also the probable shooter of Franz Schwaiger sw of Regensburg after a long chase.

The combined 355th and 357th FG lost three Mustangs to Me 109s and possibly one to a Me 110 if Steiner See is same as Lake Wessling. 7./ZG26 claimed a Mustang at Steiner See. Two other P-51s were lost colliding with their Me 110 victims so it it is possible that the Steiner See award was made on the basis of the collision... the two P-51s that 357th lost to MaC were ene of Munich in the Landshut/Erding area.

In all the Woods list has 8 Mustang/1 P-47 awards in Munich area (not possible for any P-47 to fly east of Mannheim) plus four 'supplemental claims'.

Total losses in fighters air combat with Me 109s were four P-51s (three in Waldkraiburg to Muhldorf area, one at Lake Wessling) and two to MAC w/Me 110s of ZG26 (which are not in Woods lists unless the ZG26 claim references a MAC award).

Dahl's claims 'raum Munich' to not seem anywhere close to actual losses.

[strafer]

Dear Bill,
I would like to mention the engagement that occurred on April 20, 1945 in the vicinity of Prague, Czechoslovakia. The group's opponent was probably III./JG 27.
Regards, Filip

[drgondog]

Originally Posted by strafer

Dear Bill,
I would like to mention the engagement that occurred on April 20, 1945 in the vicinity of Prague, Czechoslovakia. The group's opponent was probably III./JG 27.
Regards, Filip

Thanks Filip - were they based at Kbely? or Letnany?